KM Discussion Forum

Transparency and Accountability in Church/ Religious Institutions

 

Subject: Re: Re: IS OMAN PCO SO UNCLEAN AND CORRUPT ?
Name: David D'Costa
Date Posted: Nov 9, 03 - 2:49 AM
IP Address: 212.72.21.10
Message: What say you PCO? Why are thou so silent??

Silence is golden, but not in this case !!!

I had heard so much rumours in this matter from the protestants in Ruwi and Ghala and we Catholics were surprised, but then I know that it is true.

The Ghala Church Caretaker was Mohan, who was found half-dead in his bathroom, holding on to a bottle of alchohol. He was rushed to the ICU in Royal Hospital and never regained consciousness properly and died after a few days.

He was in fact a Hindu who lied that he is a Christian convert, just to get this job. He was running a alchohol supply and bar in his portacabin behind the church. He used to steal many things from the church and Bible society portacabin and sell them.

The icing on the cake was that he kept a runaway muslim housemaid as his mistress for almost a year, and though many noticed her presence there, nobody bothered to enquire.

The PCO made such a public sympathy for this caretaker and sent his family a good sum of money. And whoever brought up this story were hushed and branded as rumour mongers.

It is an excellent piece of journalism to expose the mishandling of PCO funds and other expenses. Wel done KM.

I feel along with all the other people who browse this site daily like our newspaper, that the PCO should respond to these allegations. Their silence has only made this issue much more believeable!!!

Most definitely, they cannot deny these charges and the only way that they can do is to publish all their expenses on the church notice boards in Ruwi and Ghala, plus explain what is the logic (if any) in paying such exhorbitant salaries to their employees - when they can definitely get better people on lesser pay and benefits.

What was mentioned about the full attendance at church get-togethers and sparse attendance at prayer meeting is definitely true - many many people who left PCO and attend other congregations have mentioned this.

The PCO is merely a ground for Christian socialising and a stopover enroute to picnics and dinners / lunches.

The Catholics have been always accused by the Protestants as Blind followers of the Vatican, but what an example are these self-righteous Protestants radiating in front of the non-protestants and non-christians.

Please be informed all you readers of this letter, that this stupidity of the PCO should never be used as a measuring rod to judge the other PCO denominations as well as the Catholics.

The crying shame in this whole episode is that they have an equally curropt Auditor to justify their statement of accounts !!!May God save the other Christiand and their denominations from such embarassments.

Thanks KM so much for this excellent feature on the PCO.

Bro.David

Ruwi High Street..porn high street!

Localisation has been doing good to the people of Oman in some segments.
But in another segment, it seems it is eroding the cuture of the people.
The Ruwi High Street is nowadays the scene of street hawkers selling
pirated video and audi CDs, DVDs and cassettes.
There are some 43 hawkers and a host of conduits selling these stuff
during evening house. Once the clandestinely sold porn video CDs and DVDs are
now available openly for a throwaway price of RO2.000.
You name it you will have that porn movie available immediately at the
pavement 'stalls.' ironically, there is no action from the authorities
to stop this at least during the Holy month of Ramadan.

Subject: IS OMAN PCO SO UNCLEAN AND CORRUPT ?
Name: sarah
Date Posted: Nov 6, 03 - 12:42 AM
IP Address: 212.72.14.63
Message: Goodness !
you guys in PCO are a real bunch of deceivers, now wonder the christians are hated so much by the muslims. They are more godly and true to their beliefs and faith than the christians.

How could you wash all your dirty linen in public and launder them so openly. In Dubai ( i am from Dubai ) we have so many churches with different denominations yet the unity and love we share is enough to make others stop and watch and see our love for one other.

It is important to have trust among believers, if we are true christians along with faith we need to have something call honesty within, if the church committee controls the church and they are so unclean and support all kinds of nonsense ( goodness a caretake bootlegging and having a mistress - where is the chairman and the pastor of the committee and church ?)and yet supported him for his medical bills, do you think God would bless you for this? if he is a just God I dont think, at least this is what I have been lead to belive.

Look at the muslims and their mosques, they are only i repeat only used to WORSHIP AND PRAY TO THEIR GOD and not socialize , have parties, or announce balls, but from what I have heard the PCO has more of these activities than bible study groups, or prayer groups ( if resources are to be believed for the prayer meetings it is difficult to find more than 15 people - come on with a congregation like that how can only so many come for a prayer meeting and hundreds turn out for the balls and gatherings - shame on you, it is people like you who bring shame to the very religion and crucify jesus every day even in the year 2003)

Look to the muslims and learn, they give the poor, esp within their community, pray regularly, fast when they have to ( a minority may not fit this description but at least the majority do things sincerely which attracts muslims the world over )

PCO pastors are seen enjoying dinner, or clubs and generally having a good life like any other secular person and there is nothing christian about them. If the church committee consists of people who are not capable then you need to appoint apt people to handle things esp a church.

Christianity means to sacrifice and here we see people earning well, living a good life with their well paid jobs and facilities ( 600 rials for a secretary , even the best companies do not pay so well ) - no wonder PCO has no funds and want more ------ it is time to cut down on cost and make sure you manage with the existing funds.

Please focuss on your church and act like true christians, search within before you take major decisions. May the peace of Christ be with all of you, and help you in discerning matters which are beyond you.

 

Subject: Be Transparent PCO committee
Name: Ramanathan Vasudevan
Date Posted: Nov 4, 03 - 7:02 AM
IP Address: 212.72.21.10
Message: We folks in the Hindu Community are amazed,that these American-British Church still hold onto colonial mentalities and that there are still Indians there who accept this attitude !!!Wake-up guys, this is 2003 and not the 1900s!!

I am an auditor by profesion and we have a moral obligation to our clients not just to audit accounts, but also to monitor and verify all sources of expenses and to advise and guide the Management as to how to keep the company running on as much profits as possible. In company terms, it is called Financial controllers or Financial managers.

Everybody has the right to question/comment on the money spent by them !!! Committees are appointed to do a better job than the previous committees!!! Not just to enjoy their term in office.
After discussing the matter of the PCO with a large section of the Protestant community, I found out that their denominations are well managed financially and every member of their congregation keeps questioning the expenses and also helps in controlling waste of money. Money from any religion should be used for propagation of their faith and for social and constructive purposes.
Christians have done this very sucessfully to a large extent worldwide. Nobody is perfect and no Government can function better and better unless there is an equally good opposition in the parliament.

The truth hurts, but the wise will learn from their mistakes. Yes, you can employ people in all positions in the PCO for lower salaries and benefits and with better capabilities. Why not advertise in the local newspapers and see the response?

You must only employ people of your faith and beliefs, like the muslim and hindu communities do. All these employees must be monitored to be sure that they will not bring shame to the church or community with their bad behaviour or social life.

Do you realise that the church parking lots in Ruwi and Ghala is used by some local people for sexual activities in cars? This happens in afternoons and late nights. You can see cars with dark tinted glasses parked with their engine running and the air-con at full blast. You should keep caretakers to monitor all vehicles parked in your compound. Instead they are all over the place, laughing and joking with the public.

The PCO has many denominations who rent out the premises for their worship activities and they should also be given representations in meetings as to the accountability and utility of PCO incomes.
The regular meetings you had with all denominations should be re-started and handled professionally and use it as a platform to hear grievances, suggestions, critizisms, opinions and ideas.
Keep a suggestion box in both churches for people to address their opinions even if they wish to stay anonymous. What is important is the feedback and not the source.
We have implemented these things in our Hindu temple administration and it is very successful. The Catholic community does a very good job in fimancial management of their incomes and we take inputs from them as well as give them our inputs.
It is good that many people have broken the silence and voiced their views.
I have never bothered to even find out who the editor of keralamonitor is or the identities of the people who send in their letters!!
I am more bothered about the authenticity of their claims and accusations - which I found to be very honest and truthful.
Remember that the sooner you clean up your backyard, the lesser the publicity. The damage is done, but you can wake-up and correct your mistakes.
What you should all understand here is that nobody hates you !!! they just hate what you do !!!
So take a positive mental attitude on these accusations and either be humble and invite constructive views and solutions, or continue to be the joke of muscat.
Kudos to all at Kerala Monitor !!!
Replies:
being transparent by Reynolds · Nov 4, 03 - 8:28 PM

I am an auditor by profesion and we have a moral obligation to our clients not just to audit accounts, but also to monitor and verify all sources of expenses and to advise and guide the Management as to how to keep the company running on as much profits as possible. In company terms, it is called Financial controllers or Financial managers.
Everybody has the right to question/comment on the money spent by them !!! Committees are appointed to do a better job than the previous committees!!! Not just to enjoy their term in office.
After discussing the matter of the PCO with a large section of the Protestant community, I found out that their denominations are well managed financially and every member of their congregation keeps questioning the expenses and also helps in controlling waste of money. Money from any religion should be used for propagation of their faith and for social and constructive purposes.
Christians have done this very sucessfully to a large extent worldwide. Nobody is perfect and no Government can function better and better unless there is an equally good opposition in the parliament.
The truth hurts, but the wise will learn from their mistakes. Yes, you can employ people in all positions in the PCO for lower salaries and benefits and with better capabilities.
Why not advertise in the local newspapers and see the response?
You must only employ people of your faith and beliefs, like the muslim and hindu communities do. All these employees must be monitored to be sure that they will not bring shame to the church or community with their bad behaviour or social life.
Do you realise that the church parking lots in Ruwi and Ghala is used by some local people for sexual activities in cars? This happens in afternoons and late nights. You can see cars with dark tinted glasses parked with their engine running and the air-con at full blast.
You should keep caretakers to monitor all vehicles parked in your compound. Instead they are all over the place, laughing and joking with the public.
The PCO has many denominations who rent out the premises for their worship activities and they should also be given representations in meetings as to the accountability and utility of PCO incomes.
The regular meetings you had with all denominations should be re-started and handled professionally and use it as a platform to hear grievances, suggestions, critizisms, opinions and ideas.
Keep a suggestion box in both churches for people to address their opinions even if they wish to stay anonymous. What is important is the feedback and not the source.
We have implemented these things in our Hindu temple administration and it is very successful. The Catholic community does a very good job in fimancial management of their incomes and we take inputs from them as well as give them our inputs.
It is good that many people have broken the silence and voiced their views.
I have never bothered to even find out who the editor of keralamonitor is or the identities of the people who send in their letters!!
I am more bothered about the authenticity of their claims and accusations - which I found to be very honest and truthful.
Remember that the sooner you clean up your backyard, the lesser the publicity. The damage is done, but you can wake-up and correct your mistakes.
What you should all understand here is that nobody hates you !!! they just hate what you do !!!
So take a positive mental attitude on these accusations and either be humble and invite constructive views and solutions, or continue to be the joke of muscat.
Kudos to all at Kerala Monitor !!!
Replies:
being transparent by Reynolds · Nov 4, 03 - 8:28 PM

Subject: being transparent
Name: Reynolds
Date Posted: Nov 4, 03 - 8:28 PM
IP Address: 212.72.12.110

Message: I agree with you regarding the PCO and their activities, any church organization should be transparent and trustworthy enough for people to go and worship with their hearts and minds open.

If the church itself is corrupt and run by crooks and manipulators and the chairman and others support then where do the innocent worshippers turn to? how do you expect them to have a 'christ like ' attitude?and how do you expect the people to be honest and clean in their lives when the committee that controls ( YES CONTROLS ) the church are very unclean.

It is time to change the committee itself and clean up the church - instead of white washing the walls why dont you rebuild it from a scratch- ISNT THAT WHAT CHRIST IS TELLING US TO DO.
I am sure if the committee is shuffled and you get rid of unwanted elements who infest and manifest all dirty politics, it would be a better place for everyone to come and worship, sans the denominations.

EVERYONE WORSHIPPING IN ONE SPIRIT - which is not done now, we see divisions and partititions within the church. It is sad. Pastors claim they are in the church for years and yet how many of the congregation do they know? or visit ? they only go by name and status and socialize accordingly, whereas Christ went seeking the poor and needy, whose ideas are you following PCO ? this is definely not from the bible.

It is a well known fact that the American - British will always try to monopolise the countries and people as they feel they are superior in everything and people let go all the time, but in todays world where people are moving forward , it is time we opened are eyes and not let people cheat us of what we deserve and what is ours. Stealing or making money in the name of the religion is not the done thing. What about the fixed deposit assets PCO has ( rental money ) we do have the figures and waiting for PCO to come clean. If you are keeping the Fixed deposit funds and still asking people to contribute that shows your greed and not need.

Hope you are praying for these areas and God's wisdom to dawn for the leaders , members and the so called decision makers

God bless you all

 

 

Subject: PCO Funds an eye opener ...
Name: Reynolds
Date Posted: Nov 3, 03 - 12:22 PM
IP Address: 212.72.17.211

Message: yes the question is why is everyone trying to put a wet blanket and cover things, didnt Christ punish the wrong and bring them into the open?
dont you think it is time the council was changed and things were done to improve the Christian lives of others, by getting an unbiased pastor, to take care of his lost sheep/flock. Or do you want to continue giving blindly into the committee and let them thrive, controlling things for as long as it pleases them.

It is interesting to know that the pastors or elders or the so called council members only visit the affluent and dont even know people who are the simple and less fortunate ones, a mere hand shake in the church is not what Christ wanted. Are you listening out there. Christ wanted us to practise what we preached and not just preach because one gets paid for it.

How many sick people does the church visit or is the pastor aware of?
Please pray for God's wisdom and not man's ideas here. Arent we supposed to be one body in Christ? then my question is is everyone at PCO treated equally ? look around and you all will know what it points to, look at the RC church and see how united they are. Yet, we talk about being BORN AGAIN ? very ironic, that we let everyone assume we walk close to Christ and yet do something totally parallel in our lives. If the church does not come out clean then how do the church goers lead a simple clean life, which is pure and holy in God's eyes.

Be blessed and it is time that the council be reviewed seriously, and made some shuffling around and to get rid of some unwanted elements, who are a curse to the church instead of a blessing, like dry trees that do no bear fruit.

Chairman, please wake up and try to please God and not men as the Church is His.

Reynold